Under the Banner
Posted on August 26th, 2005 by catalyst into the Uncategorized categoryI recently read the book Under the Banner of Heaven by Jon Krakeur. The book is a stirring criticique of Fundamental Mormonism, Mormonism and religion in general. Part of the book focuses on Colorado City, Colorado where polygamy is common practice. In this city of several thousand, girls as young as twelve are forced to marry men four times their age, Incest and pedophia are rampant. Sadly, all these acts are committed in the name of God. If a girl resists, the leaders tell them its what God wants.
(Before Christians get too sanctimonious, remember that our founding father, Abraham, almost killed his son, because he believed its what God wanted.)
For me the most compelling quote in the book came from an excommunicated member of the fundamentalist church in Colorado, named DeLoy. This father of 16 left the church after he realized the leadership was lying. Deloy still lives in Colorado City, but the church leadership is trying to evict him. His life is conflicted, for he continues to love the church, he just no longer believes. Here is his final quote:
“If you want to know the truth, I think people within the religion -people who live here in Colorado City- are probably happier, on the whole, than people on the outside…. ….but somethings in life are more important than being happy. Like being free to think for yourself.”
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August 26th, 2005 at 8:23 am
True statement
My meds agree.
August 26th, 2005 at 2:48 pm
I don’t know what you’re talking about.
Didn’t you hear Marc’s sermon?
Clearly you can drink any Starbucks coffee you want.
That’s the definition of free thinking.
August 26th, 2005 at 8:38 pm
Catalyst, are you honestly comparing CBC to an extreme sect of the Mormon church?
August 27th, 2005 at 1:58 am
RP & Catalyst are the WinCo. of food for thought! Hannah, you drew your own conclusions based on the uncanny resemblance between a Mormon sect and CBCult.
August 27th, 2005 at 4:56 am
No, I’m not comparing City Bible to Fundamental Mormonism. I’m comparing Christianity to Fundamental Mormonism. That way I can offend a lot more people.
All religions claim to hear from God. But there is no way to prove you are truly hearing from God. Abraham is a good example. I’m supposed to take Abraham’s sacrifice as an example of obedience to God. But I don’t.
Guess what? If God tells you to kill your son, I suggest you disobey. I suggest you ask God to calm down and chill out, because you’re not killing anyone in his name.
Its all a matter of degrees.
Killin it.
August 27th, 2005 at 12:11 pm
For the record, I haven’t draw any conclusions. Having known both RP and Catalyst for years, I wouldn’t put it past them to draw a correlation between the two, which is why I was seeking some clarification. There are definitely some similarities between Deloy’s quote and what is sometimes experienced at CBC, and I’m not denying that. But I also know many people who attend CBC who are more than capable of of thinking for themselves and are still perfectly happy to be at CBC. Okay, yet another question (not a conclusion): was Abraham wrong to obey God to the point of being willing to sacrifice the life of his son? If he’d told God to chill out instead of simply trust him, would he still had been the father of a nation? Who knows, I guess that’s one of those questions we’ll be able to ask God when we get there. I do know that God (not my CBC church leadership) has led me to do seemingly crazy things and never with tragic results. I also believe that God has my best interests in mind, and would never ask me to do anything that would bring harm to myself or anyone else. Wasn’t that the ultimate lesson that Abraham learned, was that the promise that God made was one He intended to keep, and that Abraham was able to fully trust Him?
August 27th, 2005 at 3:59 pm
Just out of curiosity… How do you know for certain that it is God you are hearing from. I’ve heard of people having dreams that they were certain were from God, that ended up being completely false. If you hear God speaking to you, how do you know you don’t simply have schitzophrenia? I have to think that most people doing destructive things “in God’s name” fully believe that they are indeed being led by God. They are simply stepping out in faith.
I would rather error on the side of not obeying God, instead of mistakenly killing my child.
August 29th, 2005 at 7:55 am
Anyone else see today’s Dilbert cartoon?
http://www.dilbert.com/comics/dilbert/archive/images/dilbert2915690050829.gif
August 29th, 2005 at 5:40 pm
The Dilbert cartoon is awesome, thanks for sharing!
August 29th, 2005 at 9:34 pm
Hey anon who keeps telling that hannah that she’s got a mental illness - why don’t you shut the fuck up
August 30th, 2005 at 7:05 am
Wow! Hostile and ignorant, lethal combo!
August 30th, 2005 at 4:15 pm
Thank you anon. Nice to know we have another “fine” typical american amongst us.
September 6th, 2005 at 12:32 pm
Maybe he’s Canadian