MegaChurch and Politics
Posted on July 30th, 2006 by catalyst into the Uncategorized categoryThere's a fascinating article in the New York Times this morning about a pastor of a meagachurch who spoke against promoting politics in the church, and as a result of his message, the church lost 20 percent of their congregation.
Money Quote:
When the church wins the culture wars, it inevitably loses,” Mr. Boyd preached. “When it conquers the world, it becomes the world. When you put your trust in the sword, you lose the cross.”
Mr. Boyd says he is no liberal. He is opposed to abortion and thinks homosexuality is not God’s ideal. The response from his congregation at Woodland Hills Church here in suburban St. Paul — packed mostly with politically and theologically conservative, middle-class evangelicals — was passionate. Some members walked out of a sermon and never returned. By the time the dust had settled, Woodland Hills, which Mr. Boyd founded in 1992, had lost about 1,000 of its 5,000 members.
But there were also congregants who thanked Mr. Boyd, telling him they were moved to tears to hear him voice concerns they had been too afraid to share
To me the best part of this article is the details about the difficulties in running a mega-church. Just fascinating.
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July 30th, 2006 at 8:13 am
Some more quotes from the article. I think I like this guy.
And this one:
Does this mean Canada can be the light of the world if the US no longer wants the position? heh.
July 30th, 2006 at 8:20 am
Great. Now the remaining members have to give 12.5%.
July 30th, 2006 at 8:24 am
I’m not sure why this message is revolutionary to any one who has ever read the Bible. If there was ever a person in history who was in the position to use political power to bring change it was Jesus, yet he didn’t. Why the church, American evangelicals to be more precise, suddenly feel as though God wants or even needs them to become politically active is beyond me. It’s nice to see someone who has a public voice stand up. I’d vote for Mr. Boyd any day.
July 30th, 2006 at 8:33 am
Ever pondered Judas’ betrayal of Jesus? In essence, Judas tried to force Jesus into the political realm, to establish a Jewish king and rid Israel of Roman occupation. Judas tried to hijack Jesus spiritual mission and make it worldly. It led to Judas destruction.
Is the politicizing of Jesus today, a betrayal of Judas’ proportion?
July 30th, 2006 at 11:26 am
He hit the nail right on the head with this statement. When your personal politics take precedence over your faith and how you treat your fellow Christian (or the rest of the world), your priorities are out of whack.
July 30th, 2006 at 9:32 pm
I don’t vote. I don’t have little flags on my car. I don’t sing “God Bless America”. I don’t scream out “under God” when reciting the Pledge. I don’t like GW. But I disagree with this guy.
I agree with him on all his other points regarding sexuality and abortion, but this was the only sentence I needed from the article, “And Mr. Boyd has a new book out, “The Myth of a Christian Nation: How the Quest for Political Power Is Destroying the Church,” which is based on his sermons.”
This is nothing more than a weak play on liberal fear-mongering that, if elected, GW was going to force non-Christians to convert and replace school textbooks with Bibles. Add a dash of America bashing and you have a nice recipe for selling books.
Christians don’t seek political power, politicians do. If Christians were really concerned about putting themselves in power, Pat Robertson would already have been a two-time elected President.
Politicians use the religion card to win. Under pressure from scandal, Clinton was a Christian. Bush Jr was a Christian to cover up his enormous inadequacies. John Kerry was Catholic when pressed. Hillary was a Jew to win New York. No doubt she’ll find her Baptist roots in time for 2008.
The only church destroyed by politics is the pastor’s own.
July 30th, 2006 at 11:47 pm
we’re all christians… some of us are just still in the closet.
This guy sounds like somebody selling a book.
Strike the iron while it’s hot ladies and gents.
Dash of Hate and a dash of godly love and Voila!!!
You got another old guy spinning the same old yarn tha got us here in the first place.
yuk yuk yuk
July 31st, 2006 at 8:20 pm
Christ had all the opputunity to start a political movement , and his disciples, some more than others, saw this, yet Jesus went about establishing his kingdom by laying down His life for the world and calling out to the lost the last and the least, hardly the wise, noble, mighty or the strong to form the basis of a successful movement.
We as christians are not called to promote morality or point to ourselves as a model for other people to see and emulate but we are to herald the gosple and anything that superseeds that is a detrament to the cause of Christ. We are not called to rally other believers to get out the vote in an attempt to transform america but share with those people around us in the day in and day out affairs of this life the message of the cross, a much dirtier job than voting correctly.
I do believe that Christians should vote but I totally agree with former U.S. Senate chaplain Richard Halverson. “Christianity began in Galilee as a fellowship of men and women centered on Jesus Christ. It went to Greece and became a philosophy. It went to Rome and became an institution. It went to Europe and became a culture. It came to America and became an enterprise.”
July 31st, 2006 at 9:08 pm
Writing the guy off as a peddler of books would be plausible if he’d written a popular book. Remember, 20% of the congregation left as a direct result of the message the book conveys.
Had you ever heard of the guy before the NYTimes article? Seen a glowing interview in Christianity Today? If he was popular, his books would be in the window at the gospel book store - right next to the Prayer of Jabez and the Purpose Driven Church and Left Behind. Or don’t you know that authors of controversial / unpopular works are often banned from entire chains of gospel book stores?
August 1st, 2006 at 12:42 am
If you are a no-name author, there is one fail safe method of attracting attention and that is to write something unpopular, or even false. “Proud To Be An American” would sell far less than “America Sucks Ass And Jesus Was Gay”, right? That is exactly what this guy did. Would the Times even run the article if the headline was, “Christian Pastor Says Jesus Is Okay!” Nope.
There is no “vast right wing conspiracy” to take over America. Liberals were so worried that Bush was a ultra Christian radical before he was elected. Some radical. If he attended a football game and saw a John 3:16 sign he’d think that was the score.
Next Boyd says Christian theocracies were all bloody and brutal. What other governments throughout history weren’t? The Greek, Romans, Persians, Mongols, Bolsheviks = milk and honey until those damn Christians got into power.
Then he says to stop glorifying American military campaigns. I’ve never witnessed this as part of any Church service. What I have seen, is the Church pray over the soldiers currently in war, and to thank the veterans that actually made it back. Isn’t it written, “Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends” (John 15:13)?
Now to be perfectly fair, this article is typical Times - slanted and biased. Middle of the article is, “Mr. Boyd said he never intended his sermons to be taken as merely a critique of the Republican Party or the religious right. ” Yet all of the sources interviewed for the article were deliberately chosen because there were against the GOP or the religious right. Even the headline distorts Boyd’s message.
The funny thing is, is that everyone gives the GOP too much credit. The GOP didn’t rally the Christians, the DNC abandoned them. With 9/11 the GOP could have kept power for the next 20 years. Instead, they’ll be lucky to hold the Senate this November. Dumbass Howard ‘YEEEEEAAAARRRRAAAHHH” Dean calls the GOP “the white Christian party.” That alone shows how much political power Christians have in America. Nobody wants us.
August 1st, 2006 at 7:56 am
Well Marc, I got a surprise this morning. I dropped the guy an email over the weekend after reading the NYTimes article, just to say thanks and that I found the viewpoint refreshing. Here’s his reply:
Guess he is pushing his book.
What’s kinda funny about it to me, is I wrote a short article about 3 years ago (?) and posted it on my site, called One Nation Under God? So, what Greg is saying isn’t new; guess I should have developed that article into a feature book, eh?
Surprising too that he hadn’t considered the nature of Judas sin. Probably have to put out an addendum to his book, now. Still, glad someone is proclaiming the message loudly. It needs to be heard.
…
And now, for an un-limited time, you can get my new CD, Resurrection Power, and my old CD Lord, You Are, and my articles from my web site.
Oh, I feel like such a pimp now.
Wait - is it pimping if it’s free? 
August 1st, 2006 at 10:20 am
Your article is better than his. Sorry you missed out on the fame, fortune, and women.
The bottom line is that even Jesus said, “Render unto Caesar what is Caesar’s”. It’s not a new concept. Boyd just spins it with anti-American and anti-Republican flavor for hype. All this because someone asked him who he was voting for.
Boyd’s wife: “Honey I’m hungry, do you want to eat?”
Boyd: “MAN SHALL NOT LIVE ON BREAD ALONE YOU CAPITALIST PIG.”
Boyd’s wife: “…okay. Cause I was thinking steak.”
I better add a © to my posts in case Boyd is reading and wants to start a diet book. $$$$
August 1st, 2006 at 11:33 am
Good idea.
© 2006 John444. All rights reserved.
August 27th, 2008 at 3:17 am
The Gospel flourishes in nations that value religious freedom. This is why I value the United States. There are many nations where you cannot believe what you want to. I cannot discredit any nation that values religous freedom enough to include the this guarantee within its governing laws. To see nationalism as a sin in this regard is certainly allowed, but does not seem very greatful. Thank you for allowing me to post here!