Question: Would you support the legalization of marijuana if the government could regulate and tax its distribution?
Could this help pull us out of our current recession?
I say yes.
City Business Church
It is not by grace that one enters the kingdom of heaven, but by tithing. – Damazio 3:16
Yes.
Yep
Don’t just stop with marijuana. Extend the same provisions to all drugs and end the hapless “war on drugs.” It’s time for government to get out of the business of protecting each person from him/herself.
Probably, but with some reservations, provided there were appropriate restrictions as to by whom and under what circumstances it could be sold and purchased.
Hi tiresias:
While this sounds noble, I wonder if you have considered the full ramifications of your premise?
One of the principal reasons for the existence of government is to protect us from ourselves, as well as others (Romans 13:3-4).
Your same logic could be applied to the lifting of prohibitions against speeding and false advertising, etc., and would undermine consumer protection laws, safe building codes, and so forth.
-joe
Romans 13 was written in the context of the near-totalitarian regimes of Roman emperors, not a participatory democratic-republic. The government Paul describes in Romans 13 is not now limited to one person, but includes all of us. We, the people, are in charge, and we have changed the role of government in our society to one that secures individual rights. As long as my actions do not affect the rights of others, government is expected to leave me alone and allow me to pursue the things that make me happy. I have the freedom to decide what those things are.
I’m also fine with removing speed limits. Building code enforcement does not need to be done by the government. Lending institutions, private inspectors, and customers can all be involved in determining whether something was or should be built according to specified standards.
Likewise, consumer protection does not necessarily have to come from government. Private associations can perform this function.
We need to stop thinking of government as the go-to source to solve problems. With our current economic crisit, now is the perfect time to scale government back to only what is absolutely essential. The more money government takes out of the private sector, the less money there will be to invest and reinvest in the private sector — where the economy can actually grow.
I say no…and here’s why…
Legal drugs mean easy to buy (not like it’s necessarily that difficult to buy now, but still you have to ask around a bit and know the right people) and if it’s easy to buy it’s easy to smoke, and the easier to smoke the more kids their are getting hooked on the stuff. Soon enough it will become like cigarettes and 1 out of 3 junior higher’s will be standing outside their schools smoking weed in public and no one will care. Plus it’s a proven stat that a majority of kids who start drinking and smoking early on, eventually move onto harder drugs later on (which is not a good thing). I know, I know, not our problem…parents should control their kids, right? If it were only that easy. Yes, parents have the most influence in this area, but all it takes is one bad friend, easy access and no consequences before your teenage kid is doing crystal meth, running away from home, and stealing from your bank account. I would prefer to have a little help from the government if my kid gets caught smoking weed behind the school. A night in jail is a good deterrent for many.
Alex
I think it already is that way…
I honestly don’t know if it’s because I live in Portland/Pacific NW, but pretty much everyone I know smokes pot (I do not and neither does my boyfriend). All of these people I know are successful, well adjusted people. Some of them are teachers (!), some own their own businesses, some are parents (and really good parents at that), etc.
I think Dan Rydell of Sports Nights (one of the best shows EVER with the worst title and the sad history of being born during the era of laugh tracks which probably contributed to it’s short life of 2 seasons):
I know it’s more complicated than just that, but I think it’s a really good point. And another very good point he made:
Of course, these are all really Aaron Sorkin’s points…
oh yes
I have it on good authority that this blog was hatched on hash … also, Justin and JP are fond of Cheech and Chong movies …
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ha! I wish.
I totally think pot should be legalized and for exactly the reason JP laid out above. I don’t think it’s any worse of a drug than alcohol. And we tried the prohibition once in this country, and it didn’t work.
That said, I totally prefer booze to marijuana.
Hi tiresias:
We must never allow acceptance of/obedience to the timeless principles of Scripture to be (supposedly) trumped or waved aside with rationalistic disclaimers, nor mental gymnastics.
Do you actually believe Paul would endorse not submitting to Government — so long as it does not contradict/induce breaking God’s Law –because it exists in a different form than he lived under?
Or that he would allow Philemon to keep Onesimus enslaved because he lived under Greco and not Roman law?
Frankly, this rationale reminds me of the mistaken hermeneutic Dispensationalist expositors employ to twist the Word with their now including/now rejecting of the various Books of the New Testament, in order to garner support for their strained system of interpretation:
1. The injunctions spoken by Jesus as contained in the Gospels are not applicable to us today, since they were spoken to Jews worshiping under the Mosaic economy, and living under Roman rule.
2. We are not to accept doctrine based upon the Book of Acts as it was written during a supposed inter-Testamental transitional period.
3. 1 & 2 Timothy, Titus, Philemon along with 2 & 3 John has nothing for us today, as they were written some 2,000 years ago to individuals now deceased.
4. The Books of Hebrews, James and 1 & 2 Peter are excluded for Gentiles and are only binding upon the Diaspora to whom they were written.
And on it goes.
Good luck procuring enforcement of privatized law/codes — much less retributive measures — without Government backing.
-joe
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I agree with you. I have argued with my son in law on this point. I think the only way I would want to see it used legally is under a physicians care. And then in all reality I don’t know what it would really be good for, eating disorders. I guess I would need to understand the drug more in using it as a controlled substance. As an uncontrolled substance I have had many years of first hand useage and it turly didn’t do me one bit of good, other than a good laugh once in awhile, oh yeah and then there were all those profound thoughts.
I would HATE to see my grandchildren in a room with a bunch of pot smokers. And you know people would smoke it around their kids. Or government would have to step in and regulate. I think we would be opening up pandoras box.
What makes pot any different than Alcohol? I seems to me that smoking pot is actually a little safer than drinking alcohol…so why allow one and not the other?
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Now you sound like my son in law. For one thing if you smoke pot around the kids they get to get high with you. The other thing is you get to be brainless and what we used to call “burnt out”. It took the life out of me. But maybe I’m the only one. If you compare alcohol with weed I think your missing the point. Anytime a substance is abused it can hurt others. That’s why I believe pot should be a controlled. We are not governed enough as a culture to smoke weed and use it wisely.
Oh joy our kids can stand around on their class room breaks and smoke pot, go back and really learn alot. It messes with our brain and it can also cause problems genetically I have read.
And yes people do it anyway but at least there is some kind of “if I get caught I can get in trouble”, that can protect the children a little bit.
It sucks when you have divorces, and how many divorced family’s do we have in this country where there is a mindless freaking pot head, smoking pot around their kids and the other parent is trying to have some kind of government in their lives and you got this crap always undermining the process of a decent life!!! Give me a break. Who gives a rip about balancing the budget by legalising pot. There are other ways, don’t ask me how, because it’s all too complicated for me.
Reformed Pope said:
I wonder if the answer to your question is because of the difference of intensity over time.
When I was a teenager, I recall it used to take a fair amount of time (20-30 minutes) to get a buzz on from the beer we had talked one of the older guys into buying for us (the fee charged was 2 per sixer).
Somewhat the same for the low-grade pot we bought by the lid ($10$ for a 3-finger lid, $15 for a four-finger) back then, as it took an entire joint for one to catch a buzz, and about 1/2 an hour — about equal to the buzz and time it took to down 2-3 Blitzs.
But the stuff these guys smoke nowadays, by the ounce, is a whole other animal as to potency. What I gather from the web is that today’s pot contains 4-7 times as much THC as pot from the 70s.
I worked with a dude who after only two hits of the current stuff, would go from totally straight to totally wasted after only two or 3 hits…maybe 2-3 minutes max.
-joe
AnnaLytical, you clearly have personal issues with pot and i won’t try and debate you other than to say none of your answers make any sense at all.
joebib, what difference does it make how quickly you get stoned? You can get drunk real quick if you want to. Some people will abuse pot just like they could abuse alcohol…i still don’t see the differnece.
Can anyone explain to me why alcohol should be legal and pot not?
3-4 beers in a couple hours will get ya 2 oz alcohol. OTOH, a couple back to back shots of whiskey will put the same alcohol in your system in minutes.
Pope – you got a good brownie recipe you can post?
any guess on how much dope was smoked by tchs kids back in the day?
tchs?
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I really can’t defend either Pope…but that’s also because I don’t enjoy either. Alcohol seems just as harmful to me as weed but obviously much harder to control. If there was a way to control it, hell I wouldn’t care. The only reason I can think of to allow drinking but not smoking is addictiveness. Seems like a lot more kids that I knew (based solely on my experiences of course) could have a few beers now and again and be just fine…however those I knew who smoked weed, never stopped. Most of the drinkers I knew in my younger years still went onto college and did something with their lives. The pot heads…well they are still pretty much pot heads…if not worse. But end the end, you’re right…not much difference.
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Temple Christian High School
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Yes I clearly do have issues with pot and with all drugs if not used properly. And in answering your question specifically my experience is the same as joe bib. 60′s and 70′s pot was very different than even 80′s pot. It is powerful stuff. I truly believe it is a gate way drug. When you are around pot you will find other durgs, there will be abuses and it to is addictive. That has been my personal experience and if anyone can refute this then let me know.
And my question to you is why are we comparing pot to alcohol, why not compare pot to meth, why not compare pot to crank, why not compare pot to other drugs. What is the difference? They can all be addictive and abused. Are we comparing pot to alcohol to justify legalizing it or using it so we can be o.k. with it?
What I am trying to convey is that we are an addictive culture why legalize one more item that we can all become addicted to. Why subject our children to it. If it’s in the stores you can buy it and to me that’s one more choice we don’t need.
The bible says all things are lawful but not all things are profitable, and I don’t think Paul is just talking about money. Another scripture is our body is the temple of the Holy Spirit. Drugs are a way for satan to get ahold of our lives. It can and is used to manipulate people. There is much admonishment in the word on the subject of alcohol let alone pot.
I don’t know if you are looking for cold hard facts as to alcohol does this and pot does that. I’m sure there is much information on the internet to enlighten us on that subject.
We as the people of God should be walking in a spirit of wisdom and I don’t think legalizing pot is wisdom.
At any rate from your first comment I don’t think we have any disagreements personally on the subject.
However to you Michael Phelps, it could get us out of one situation and into a much worse situation. Lets press on towards wisdom on this subject.
I always wonder if it’s the drug itself that is a gateway or is it the illegality of the pot that makes it a gateway. If you made pot legal would it lose it’s gateway status. And isn’t alcohol also a gateway drug. How many meth addicts probably started experimenting with booze in the early years.
Because it’s affect on your body isn’t as harmful as other drugs, like meth, heroin or cocaine. It also has to do with pot’s affect on other people. Marijuana addicts generally only harm themselves, not others. You can’t say the same for meth or heroin or crack addicts.
I don’t defend the use of pot. Frankly, you’ll lead a better more productive life not smoking it. However, it annoys me that we spend billions of dollars in this country fighting a drug that is really just a plant in the ground. I think we could spend the money on much better programs. And if we legalized it, we could tax it, and raise even more money. In addition, we would cut off the financing of a lot of the drug traffickers.
Lastly, let me say that a major killer in America is heart disease. And eating fast food is a big contributor to that disease. People shouldn’t eat fast food. But we let them, because we’re a free society and, in general, we let people make choices about what they want to do to their body.
I think the same rationale applies to pot.
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Excuse me, I like protection, thank-you Lord for protecting me from myself otherwise I would have been dead along time ago. I call that mercy and grace in a time of ignorance and foolishness.
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Come on joe I thought you had more backbone than that!
All of these people I know are successful, well adjusted people. Some of them are teachers (!), some own their own businesses, some are parents (and really good parents at that), etc.
Depends on what you consider successful and well adjusted. In my neck of the woods all kinds of teachers these days are taking sexual advantages of their students. Our we living in a sane culture?
Come on people!! I mean “christians”.
Because it’s affect on your body isn’t as harmful as other drugs, like meth, heroin or cocaine. It also has to do with pot’s affect on other people. Marijuana addicts generally only harm themselves, not others. You can’t say the same for meth or heroin or crack addicts.
I don’t have this block quote thing down. What I hear you saying is that if I only hurt myself it doesn’t hurt others. In my experience that is not true. When people hurt themselves it does hurt me. We need to look at the bigger picture.
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OK so we waste our money on all kinds of things don’t you think this is a good use of money? How is it being wasted? How are we going to cut off the financing of the drug trafficters? And as far as I know all drugs come from a plant in the ground.
If you look at all the damage that alcohol does to families and society, we as a society should totally outlaw it. But, we don’t. Because we tried it once in the early 20′s, and it wasn’t worth it. It didn’t stop the consumption of alcohol. And it led to an increase in the power of the mafia.
Anna, I think we’re coming at this from two different points. You think pot should be illegal because it’s harmful, and as a moral issue, we shouldn’t allow people to participate in harmful activities.
I’m coming at it from a practical standpoint and saying that while I agree with you that it’s harmful. In practicallity, outlawing marijuana doesn’t prevent its use, it only creates an revenue stream for drug traffickers.
But I take your point. I just think this is an area where we agree to disagree.
We also fight alcohol abuse etc. we are still going to be spending billions of dollars on it either way. We might as well legalize everything else like tiresas says. Then government can be in control of it all…crime a nutly.
Do you really trust our government with our money and how it is being spent?
I agree it doesn’t prevent it’s use but at least we have some control over it and I’m thinking of our children. I don’t see how it is practical at this moment in time in our country.
I don’t know about the mafia and all that. I just think there will always be something else. How well are countries doing that have legalization of it? Where are they at morally?
One more thing then I have to go, shouldn’t we as christians be concerned about the moral aspects of our culure, regardless of the practicalness of it? Regardless of the revenue we will receive from it.
Also I don’t think we are smart enough to conceive in our minds all the harmfull affects of legalizing pot? I really think we need to pray hard to God on this subject as christians least we lose our salt as a people. We are already so watered down.
It’s like, lets legalize prostitution, then we can get the revenue. I think the mafia is still involved in that. Now we are having in the forefront of our country the prostitution of our children, slavery. It’s been in the news left and right lately. It’s just one more stair step down as far as I am concerned. I say we need to fight for laws that will help us.
I’m not throwing the sword down on this one. I’m sick of it.
No.
Actully I was asking Catalyst.
However since you answered are you saying no to the moral aspect or the practicalness of it?
Sure. But when it comes to enacting laws around morality, I begin to think practically. Outlaw murder and rape. Don’t outlaw obesity and smoking pot.
Sorry for interrupting…I mistook this for an open forum. I’ll go back to my bitterness and leave you alone now.
I can absolutely appreciate your point that the word “success”, when being applied to an individual, is subjective — but seeing as I actually know these people and am above average intelligence, I believe my evaluation of them as “successful” people is valid. I don’t think all teachers are shining beacons of light – my point was that there are active (pot smoking) members of society who contribute positively to other peoples lives on a daily basis. Just because I cited teachers (that I actually know) who smoke pot, and you have heard of teachers who abuse their authority, doesn’t render my point invalid.
One more thing: just because I have personal experiences with people who smoke pot and those experiences are NOT negative, does not mean that your experiences are any less important or valid. I am sure you know that, but I want you to know that I know that as well.
I had a best friend when I was 14 who by the time she was 15 was smoking pot every day. She had been beautiful, funny, sweet, etc. She was still beautiful, but she became, well, dumb. I have no idea how much pot she was smoking…but I do know that the thrill of its being illegal was the half the draw for her. Anyhow, I still think that pot should be legalized. Cigarettes were legal and you had to be 18 to smoke them…she and I both smoked cigarettes but they were much harder for us to get and so we rarely were able to. I think it would be better if pot were that way.
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Hi A-Lit;
Thanks for the moral outrage at my legalistic lapse. I don’t know what came over me.
But it’s not my fault…you may blame Samaritan. It all started when my proctologist ran out of gin-soaked raisins. Sammy kindly offered me some of his homebrewed hooch. I can still hear him:
Jesus drank wine, right?
OK jack, fill ‘er up.
From there it wasn’t long till I was on my way to Cuban cigars, low-grade Cannabis, and finally the jackpot: skunk bud.
Seriously though, I would favor Marijuana’s use if it were prescribed under a doctor’s care as a treatment for a medical condition.
In that instance, how would it be any different than taking Valium, Percodan or Darvoset?
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I don’t disagree on that. All out legallization I have a problem with.
Sam says he gets you likkered up so you quit the ‘Bib-speak’ and start talking human …
But only temporarily, and after chasin his hooch with 2-3 of these.
-joe
That’s disgusting – they ought to put that stuff back in the horse they got it out of …