Champaigne and cavier only, please

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From the "I lack complete self-awareness" file, you get this lovely story from a bankrupt megachurch in California:  

Some members of a bankrupt Orange County, Calif. megachurch are expressing outrage after fielding an email request for congregants to deliver food to waiting limos so that it can ferried to the founder's sick wife. The appeal comes weeks after a lawsuit charged that the founder of the Crystal Cathedral house of worship, Rev. Robert Schuller, and his family had been paying themselves lavish salaries and other benefits while the church was in financial straits.

I know what you're thinking, "Why don't they just sell the limos and then use that money to buy food?" Fool! Where is the fun in that? Everything tastes better after it has been delivered in a limo: pizza, corndogs, snow-cones. Seriously, everything.  You people should try it.

Sometimes, I think this is all big joke with these pastors and they are all trying to figure out who can get their congregation to do the most ridiculous thing. Frank Damazio had "Faith Harvest."  Reverend Robert Schuller has "Deliver My Wife Food in a Limo."

Your move, Frank.

City Bible sells 217 Campus

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Not really sure what this means, but City Bible sold their 217 campus to Westside Christian High.

I assume City Bible is still going to meet at the building, they just won't own it. Whch I'm sure will cut down on their expenses. Not a bad move. But I can't help but think that maybe if they had just tithed more, they wouldn't have to sell. The prosperity gospel being sound economic policy and all.

That doesn’t look like candy you just put in my bag.

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Reader Just Thinking brought this Halloween news article to my attention. An Evangelical group is challenging Christians to pass out mini-Bibles instead of candy at Halloween this year.

JesusWeen founder Pastor Paul Ade began replacing sugar with scripture in 2002. "All it took was putting a bible into every bag as they opened each bag with a smile," declares the JesusWeen website, adding that it was "much easier than expected" to trick kids into thinking the Bible was a treat.

How stupid do they think children are? Trust me, kids know when they are getting candy and when they are getting a book. This sounds like an excellent opportunity for you to get your house egged. If I was a kid trick or treating and I got a book, I'd be like, "Um yeah, you want to try that again."

Also, how would Christians feel if a Mormon family was passing out the Book of Mormon instead of candy. You think they would appreciate the religious fervor? 

If you really want to share the Love of Christ with children, it seems to me it would be better to just pass out regular size candy bars, instead of mini bars. You do that and, trust me, every kid on the block will remember you and your message.


 

Pro Tip: Don’t have Sex with a Sun Goddess

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A reader recommended I listen to a conversation on Fresh Air with C. Peter Wagner where he discusses the New Apostolic Reformation. I didn't actually listen to the whole interview, but NPR has a thorough round up of the interview. Also, Detox mentions the conversation in one of her comments.

Wagner's chief claim is that the Tsunami in Japan was the result of a Japanese emporer having sex with a Sun Goddess several years ago.

Yep, you read that correct. The Japanese Tsunami was a result of sex with a Sun Goddess. 

I honestly couldn't take anymore after hearing that.

Faith Healing

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An Oregon couple was recently convicted of manslaughter for failing to seek medical help for their infant son. The child was born premature, and the couple believed that at that point it was up to God whether their son lived or died.

They belong to a church that believes that God can heal and that if it is God's will not to save an individual then so be it. I saw a clip of the couple testifying on the news, and they were pretty devastated that they lost their son. I do not doubt the sincerity in their belief of Faith Healing.

My position is that if you as an adult want to trust God to save you, then fine. But children do not have that choice. And maybe God's way of saving the child was through medical help. The libertarian side of me thinks people should be able to choose if they want medical help or not. But when it comes to children, I think the state has a right to step in and force parents to take their child to a doctor. Curious what you all think.

Is the Church at South Las Vegas guilty of fraud?

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Some interesing accusations from a reader.  Not sure how much of it is true. But if I attended the Church at South Las Vegas, I think I would stop tithing.

I just want to know one thing: Since they will obviously NOT be building the “New Building/Church” which they state they collected all of these funds for, and the congregation gave in good faith, Don’t they have to return those “designated funds” back to the Givers? It seems that they knew well in advance that they would not be able to build, yet they continued to solicit funds for the “I AM THE CHURCH” then the “Expansion/Building fund”, then “Kingdom First” then the “Wendell Smith Auditorium”…Where is that money going now? It seems that it should at a minimum be offered back to the “Givers” that Benny Perez strongly encouraged all to give, even after they obviously knew that they were not going to be able to build… That IS the RIGHT thing to do after all…

ALSO…Since we are going to split fine hairs here, what about the fact that TCSLV has now decided to create a new outreach program called: IMPACTLV which now holds the funds for the Destiny House (which btw Benny & Wendy Perez own under the name of “Perez Family Revocable Trust”). That is another issue altogether…They claim that they “Donated” the house to help rescue women being sex trafficked. The reality is that they actually occassionaly donate the USE OF the house, when they are not having INTERNS pay to live there…At any rate, IMPACTLV is now a seperate entity under Pacesetters International aka Benny Perez Ministries. Now that they are going into foreclosure and possible bankruptcy the funds they collect for that can not be taken by the Lender, can they? They created this new “Ministry” to say look what we are doing in our community. The bank (not local according to them) is the bad guy in all of this. So this begs the question isn’t this also just WRONG?

1. They knew they were not going to pay the mortgage, yet accepted tithes/offerings for the building fund for at least a year or more.
2. They knew the Destiny House was not occupied, so they moved Interns in so the Interns could pay their mortgage on their personal property, all the while continuing to solicit funds for months from the congregation, week after week for the Desting House, knowing there were no Rescued Sex Trafficked victims living there.
3. They state that they are filing a strategic bankruptcy, yet they have the funds they just choose not to pay their mortgage.

None of this is Biblical…it is called FRAUD and punishable by law…

Open Thread

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I've tried looking for something to write about these last few days, and frankly nothing has sparked my interest. I've looked for more information on the Church at South Las Vegas, but haven't seen anything. If any of you have any new information on how the bankruptcy is playing out, please post in the comments.

I was tempted to mention Pat Robertson's recent statement that it is okay to divorce your spouse if he/she has Alzheimer's. But then I actually saw the clip where Pat made his remarks and all I could think was, "Wow. These are the ramblings of an old old man". I just don't take him seriously anymore. 

Lastly, any of you who are new to the blog and have a distaste for the Prosperity Gospel, check out this YouTube clip from John Piper. We have posted it a few times before, but I thought it would be good to post again. The clip, to use the parlance of our times, is brilliant.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTc_FoELt8s 

Consider this an open thread. 

Church of the Harvest Oklahoma

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A reader asks a question:  

I have been reading this blog and I would like to know if this is the same as the Church of the Harvest in Oklahoma…my daughter just left to do an “internship” there…she had to pay them $5000 and that only gets her a room with 5 other people…our family is devistated and tried desperately to keep her here, but she was not listening to reason. She is a totally changed person…(not in a good way) and told us she had to leave her family and give up everything and hate everyone and hate the world if she wanted to walk with Jesus and be his disiple. We are scared for her mental and physical safety and don’t know what we can do. Any information would be greatly appreciated.

Mars Hill Church Expanding to Portland

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A prominent Seattle church is opening up a franchise in SE Portland. Mars Hill church will begin services at their new SE Portland campus on September 10th.  The Oregonian frames their article around the church's stance against homosexuality. But I am much more interested in how this new campus will affect membership at other conservative mega churches in Portland. From what I gather, Mars Hill is a pretty popular brand among Evangelicals in the Northwest. My guess is they increase attendance by poaching from other churches rather than converting new Christians in Portland.   

The whole one church, different campuses concept always seemed kind of odd to me. But I guess it is here to stay. People do not seem to mind going to a church where they watch the pastor on a TV Screen. At least the building Mars Hill bought is pretty cool. I'll be honest, I am kind of disappointed McMenamins didn't buy it first.

Seems like these two might have another church to review.  

Breaking Up with the Church

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A reader sends in this scathing blog post from a church member who decides to seperate from the church.

The church is the popular kids in high school picking on the artists for being different. This is NOT what Jesus intended, and I cannot be a part of that anymore.

So yeah, I’m kind of bitter, but to be clear, it’s at the institutions of the church, not the people who make up the community. I love and cherish the people we’ve met through our journey through the church, and I’ve made some real lifelong friends that I know will never abandon me despite my mad rantings. The people are really what make up the church not the ideas or structures that oppress. There are some amazing people trying to make a difference in the world through the church, and I am honored to know and have served alongside them.  Many of my friends are some of the best parts of the church.

Totally agree. On an individual level the people who make up the church are great. But sadly, on a corporate level, they kind of suck.